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Maxxis Ue-168 Tires


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#1 SeeStars

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 03:36 AM

Like many others who have gone before me, I need to get new tires. From what I have read and gleaned on the two Casita forums, Maxxis LT UE-168 appears to be the best choice. I probably will go with the 15" version. I need to find them, or order them soon.

In reading the posts, I have not come across a negative comment yet about them, other than "you're not supposed to use an LT tire". Some of the posts are several years old, or older, however.

Before I take the plunge, I would like to ask the people who are using them now what has been your updated experience with them, good or bad, pro or con?

Thanks.

Charlie

#2 baron100

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 06:38 AM

Few things generate more passion than discussion tires on the forums. Since I was not a tire expert I did a lot of research before making my decision on tires. This includes researching every related forum I could find and corresponding with different tire manufactures directly.

The picture shows my M8008 Maxxis tires at 32,000 miles being replaced with a new set of M8008 tires. My old tires have traveled from Canada to Mexico in snow, mud, gravel and washboard roads without a failure. I saw no defects in my tires when I replaced them, in fact they look almost like the new ones.

At the time I acquired my trailer there were a lot of postings about tire failures on Casitas and other travel trailers. The US manufacturers had outsourced trailer tires (ST) overseas and there were apparent startup quality problems.

At the same time, Casita and other trailer manufacturers were equipping their trailers with inadequate load rated tires on their trailers. Casita was offering ST205/75R-14, 6 ply, 1,760 lbs capacity ea.(or 3,520 total lbs) load range "C" tires, inadequate for loads experienced on the road.

The heavier SD model Casita trailers when loaded weigh up to 3,500 lbs. (Measurements at the Oregon Ralley)

I contacted Maxxis Technical Support and asked them what was the best tire I could put on my 3,400 lb loaded Casita trailer. The response was the Maxxis M8008 ST tires, 225/75R/15. load range "E" tire. These 10 ply tires are rated to carry 2,830 lbs each at 80 psi. Maxxis ST tires are specifically designed for trailers. In fact, he went so far as to say that any dealer that puts a non-ST tire on a trailer may be at legal risk as a result of putting a tire on a trailer that is not designed for trailer usage.

Discount Tire has been the largest independent tire distributor since 1960, as such they should have some insight into tires for trailer use, here is what they say:

Why Use An "ST" Tire
*"ST" tires feature materials and construction to meet the higher load requirements and demands of trailering.
* The polyester cords are bigger than they would be for a comparable "P" or "LT" tire.
* The steel cords have a larger diameter and greater tensile strength to meet the additional load requirements.
* "ST" tire rubber compounds contain more chemicals to resist weather and ozone cracking
* Always inflate trailer tires to the maximum inflation indicated on the sidewall. (They say this twice to get your
attention. Anyone that tells you over inflation of trailer tires is the leading cause for failure is WRONG).
* In approximately three years, roughly one-third of the tire's strength is gone. (Another reason why you need a tire
with a load rating that greatly exceeds the weight of your trailer).
* Three to five years is the projected life of a normal trailer tire.(forget what you know about passenger tires, it does not apply to trailer tires).
* It is suggested that trailer tires be replaced after three to four years of service regardless of tread depth or tire appearance.
http://www.discountt...erTireFacts.dos

According to Mac Demere of 'Edmunds,' nearly every tire blowout occurs on a warm day, on a straight road, at highway speeds when a tire is under-inflated.

Tire Rack says:
"Your trailer is a follower, which often makes tire sidewall flexing a negative. Sidewall flexing on trailers, especially those with a high center of gravity (enclosed/travel trailers) or that carry heavy loads, is a primary cause of trailer sway. Typical passenger radial tires with flexible sidewalls can accentuate trailer sway problems. The stiffer sidewalls and higher operating pressures common with Special Trailer (ST) designated tires help reduce trailer sway.

Goodyear Tire Company says this:
"For trailer tires, inflating near the max pressure indicated on the tire sidewall is a good option for cooler running lower rolling resistance and load-carrying capacity. If the load the tire is carrying isn't near its capacity, lower-than-maximum psi can be used (see load and inflation tables for proper inflation) and this may give a slightly better ride, but never allow the tires to be under-inflated (lower than what the trailer manufacturer recommends)."

"Industry standards dictate that ST tires are restricted to a speed of 65 mph unless a different speed restriction is indicated on the tire sidewall. If speeds from 66 to 75 mph are used, the tire cold inflation pressure can be increased by 10 psi without any increase in load." (Same thing Maxxis told me, wheel pressure maximum rating must be considered if over inflating the tires to run at higher speed).

I don't ride in my trailer so a "slightly better ride" is not a consideration. I inflate my tires at near maximum, I want the cooler tire temp and maximum load carrying capability. With some 40,000 miles now on M8008 tires without any failures, I am completely satisfied and have zero worries about tire performance as I travel down the road.

Gary at RV Forum Staff:

" Trailer tires seem to be prone to early failures. There are several potential reasons and the anecdotal reports we get are seldom detailed enough to make sound conclusions. Here are some of the major factors:

(1) Most trailers have barely adequate tires right from the factory. By that I mean that they are rated just high enough for the axle GAWR, so that they are always running right at their outer limit of capacity. To make matters worse, trailer manufacturers have been skimping on the axle ratings as well, so that the axle itself is usually loaded right to the max in normal use. In my opinion this high level of stress causes trailer tires to fail far more often than passenger car cars, which typically have a substantial safety margin in carrying capacity.

(2) Trailer tires (and RVs tires in general) do not get regular use (exercise). Instead, they sit around getting stiff and flat on one side and the anti-aging chemicals in the rubber do not get spread around. Then they get taken out on the highway and run hard and hot on the highway, usually in hot summer weather. And sometimes on rugged roads too (campground access roads). This is the worst style of usage for a tire, according to tire manufacturers, and leads to a failure rate greater than average for all tires. Some people also feel that long exposure to sun (UV damage) and contact with the ground or concrete will also cause tire damage while it sits. I don't see any meaningful difference vs passengers cars, though, and they routinely last 4-5 years or more.

(3) As with many RVs, trailer tires are often underinflated for the load. Yeah, I know, YOU always check yours and never run under-inflated (and your dog never barks in the campground either), but weight checks by the RVSafety Foundation show that a substantial percentage of RVs have one or more tires under-inflated for the actual load. An under-inflated tire flexes more than it should and gets much hotter than when properly inflated. That greatly increases the likelihood of tread separation or sidewall failure, i.e. a "blow out"."

It is my contention that most trailer tire problems are the result of using tires with inadequate load ratings for the trailer weight and loads encountered on the road along with inadequate inflation to allow the tires to handle the load. Tire age, sun damage, and not moving the trailer for long periods in storage are also contributors to failures.

Beware of the "tire experts" on the forums. Do your own research.

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Edited by baron100, 02 June 2012 - 06:45 AM.


#3 SeeStars

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 01:17 PM

...
I contacted Maxxis Technical Support and asked them what was the best tire I could put on my 3,400 lb loaded Casita trailer. The response was the Maxxis M8008 ST tires, 225/75R/15. load range "E" tire. These 10 ply tires are rated to carry 2,830 lbs each at 80 psi. Maxxis ST tires are specifically designed for trailers. In fact, he went so far as to say that any dealer that puts a non-ST tire on a trailer may be at legal risk as a result of putting a tire on a trailer that is not designed for trailer usage.


Thanks for your thoughtful reply, Rob. I appreciate the time and the information you put together. I have been doing a lot of sourcing the past few days and have discovered some interesting nuances. Today, I decided earlier before I saw your reply that Maxxis TL15703000 - Maxxis M8008 ST Tires would work for me. It is a ST205/75R15 tire, 8-ply 2150 lbs @65 psi. I would get some Dexstar 15" rims to go with them. The diameter of the tire is 27.1", only 1" larger than my current tires, and will fit easily into the wheel well. I have a 2002 17 FD with a 3500 lb. standard axle (not high rise). If my Casita was loaded to 3400 lbs, and I subtract the tongue weight (350 lbs.) to get the load on the wheels, I would be running 71% of maximum capacity. OTOH, if I selected your tires, I would be running at only 54%.

The tire you selected on the advice of Maxxis has a diameter of 28.3", and I am not certain it will fit my configuration. At extreme travel, it might contact the forward well wall. Do you have a high rise axle on your Casita? What was your experience with fit?

And, one other question. What did you get for rims?

Charlie

Edited by SeeStars, 02 June 2012 - 04:05 PM.


#4 baron100

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 05:19 PM

Charlie, I do have the high lift axle. I suspect your weight is somewhat less than mine and you will have a greater safety margin than anticipated with your planned M8008 ST205 tire. Your 8 ply load range "D" tire should be more than adequate when inflated to 65 psi.

I believe you are correct about problems with the M8008 ST225 tire on a standard axle. I have had no interference problems with the high lift axle. The issue has been discussed in the forums in the past and hopefully those involved can offer you some insight on the fit issue.

You will find the M8008 tire more readily available than the UE-168 tires if you ever require replacement down the road.

Many of us were using Rick's Tires and Wheels when I purchased my wheels several years ago. The Star 15 inch Aluminum Spoke wheel in the 5/4.5 inch lug pattern is no longer available but there are some great looking new ones now available that I have seen several posts on.

You are likely aware of the need for metal valve stems with the new tires.

I trust that tire problem anxiety will be a thing of the past for you like it has been for me..

Edited by baron100, 02 June 2012 - 05:21 PM.


#5 SeeStars

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 06:51 PM

Thanks, Rob, for your reply and answers. I have been enjoying your photographs and adventures at GNP. When were those taken?

It's unfortunate that the larger tire won't work on my trailer. I could use the extra clearance, even if only an inch. The metal stem I have located is for 0.625 hole diameters. The Dexstar steel 15" rim has a 0.453 hole, so I continue to look. eTrailer has a combination brass/rubber stem good to 100 psi, but it looks suspiciously like the one that was a major problem several years ago. I have been searching online and have found a possibility. Am awaiting a reply to a question to the manufacturer regarding it.

Charlie

#6 PrairieHawk

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 08:41 PM

Thanks Rob for your personal thoughts and tire distributor information on trailer tires. We have a 2008 SD, hi-lift axle, with the original 14" Goodyear tires with about 30,000 miles on them. We run them at 50 lbs pressure and keep the speed at 60 mph. We will be upgrading to 15 inch wheels and load range D tires very shortly for the extra safety factor. So, your post has given me additional factors to consider.

A couple of questions on your aluminum wheels. Do you have the spare on an aluminum wheel? Do you find that you have to check the tightness of the wheel lugs more often with the aluminum wheels than you did with the steel rims?

I checked out your Casita Adventures photo site. Very impressive! Glacier National Park is one of our favorites!

Bob
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#7 baron100

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Posted 02 June 2012 - 10:07 PM

Bob, thanks. I need to return to Glacier soon. Very special place for me.


You sure got a lot of service out of your original tires! You were obviously doing something right. I have heard stories about people not even making it home from picking up their new Casita on the load range "C' tires.

Keeping the speed at 60 mph undoubtedly aided you in extending the life of the tires. Did your travels include much mileage on hot days? Did you move your trailer frequently frequently or store it in a manner to prevent strain on the tires?

My current spare is on a steel rim. I know we are advised to check the tightness frequently at first, particularly when changing to aluminum wheels. Theory is that the steel lugs and aluminum wheels expand and contract at different temperatures which can result in the lugs becoming loose. I can't say I have noticed this effect. Probably a good idea to check them frequently until one understands what the effect is on your particular wheels.

Charlie, my last Glacier trip coincided with their 100 Year anniversary in 2010. Hope to be back there in August of this year.

You are right about the rubber valve stems. Caused huge problems and was well reported and documented at the time. When I bought my wheels from Rick's they provided me with the valve stems without me having to do any research.

I saw KonradSD17's nifty lift job he did on his SD axle at Quartzsite. A mod like that should provide plenty of clearance for the ST 225? Check for his posts on this forum or the other Casita forum.








#8 PrairieHawk

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 08:33 AM

Since we purchased the Casita in May 2008, the majority of our travels have been throughout the midwest with one trip to Fredricksburg, Texas in 2009. The majority of our travels were during the summer months with temperatures generally in the 80s or 90s. The one exception was a 3-month, 6,400 mile trip we took this past winter through Florida, North and South Carolina. In all of our travels, we generally never stay longer than 10 days in one area. During the previous winter months we stored the Casita outside with 2 inch thick wooden planks under the wheels. Whenever the Casita is sitting, it has protective tire covers on the wheels.

I have read some of the same horror stories other Casita owners have experienced with the Load C Goodyear tires. Fortunately, we have had an excellent experience with ours.

My thinking is to go with two aluminum wheels and a steel wheel for the spare. Just wanted to see what others are doing when switching to aluminum wheels.

I really appreciate your input on the Maxxis M8008 tires. My inclination is to go with this tire. What air pressure do you normally run on this tire?

Also, did you go with the 6 wide aluminum wheel?
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#9 baron100

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Posted 03 June 2012 - 10:02 AM

Bob, I did go with 6" width and zero offset wheels.

I have been running 75 to 80 psi on my tires after my research. Some service stations have a problem achieving that pressure so it is good to have a robust air pump so you don't rely on the station.

Many of our trailer owners operate out of Arizona and Texas. I read that a mechanic once measured with an infrared temp gauge the temperature of the asphalt on a 100F day at 138F degrees. Makes me wonder if your better luck with the stock tires might be partially related to the cooler environment you operate in along with holding the 60 mph speed.

Recipe for tire failures seems to be hot days, under inflated tires, higher speeds and tires with inadequate load range tires.

#10 Bill & Karen

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 01:05 PM

Like many others who have gone before me, I need to get new tires. From what I have read and gleaned on the two Casita forums, Maxxis LT UE-168 appears to be the best choice. I probably will go with the 15" version. I need to find them, or order them soon.

In reading the posts, I have not come across a negative comment yet about them, other than "you're not supposed to use an LT tire". Some of the posts are several years old, or older, however.

Before I take the plunge, I would like to ask the people who are using them now what has been your updated experience with them, good or bad, pro or con?

Thanks.

Charlie



Charlie, I just went through all of this and posted it on the Casita forum, was looking to copy it here and then you came along. Hope it helps, please keep in mind that this is written because my axle is mounted too far in the front of the wheel well, Bill
http://www.casitafor...6745#entry96745

Bill & Karen Sarasota, Fl. Love being Inneggsile

 


#11 SeeStars

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Posted 30 August 2012 - 06:46 PM

Like many others who have gone before me, I need to get new tires. From what I have read and gleaned on the two Casita forums, Maxxis LT UE-168 appears to be the best choice. I probably will go with the 15" version. I need to find them, or order them soon.

In reading the posts, I have not come across a negative comment yet about them, other than "you're not supposed to use an LT tire". Some of the posts are several years old, or older, however.

Before I take the plunge, I would like to ask the people who are using them now what has been your updated experience with them, good or bad, pro or con?

Thanks.

Charlie



Charlie, I just went through all of this and posted it on the Casita forum, was looking to copy it here and then you came along. Hope it helps, please keep in mind that this is written because my axle is mounted too far in the front of the wheel well, Bill
http://www.casitafor...6745#entry96745


Thanks, Bill. I contacted Maxxis back when I was looking and asked for the UE168 tire size that I wanted. They said the demand was too low to stock it. So, I went with the Maxxis M8008 ST tire. Hoping for the best. Glad you got them. As it is, I'll change tires in three years, regardless. Maybe I should start lining them up now. :blink: