19 replies to this topic

[Bobinyelm]

If you ever experienced erratic running of your Honda generator, or find it runs better w/ the choke on, you may have a clogged main jet.

Here are some excellent instructions and pictures that illustrate the cleaning process:

http://tinyurl.com/ykq6jt8

Bob

Edited by Bobinyelm, 25 February 2010 - 09:38 PM.

[Don]

Great link - thanks! Haven't had that problem yet but that fuel varnish does build up over time.
Don

[Bobinyelm]

Great link - thanks! Haven't had that problem yet but that fuel varnish does build up over time.
Don

I left some fuel in mine last year, and rather than varnish, the ethanol attracted moisture, which encouraged algae growth, and the carb was a MESS. Dried algae is impervious to solvents, and I had to disassemble the carb and use a fingernail to clean the fuel bowl, and brass wire, compressed air, and carb solvent and brake cleaner to clean the jets.

Uugh!

Gas with ethanol is nasty stuff.

The new Federal rule says that gas will soon have 15% ethanol (50% increase) and that ONE THIRD of ALL CORN grown in the USA MUST be processed into ethanol to be added to gasoline to reduce our dependence on foreign oil (since we are cutting drilling inside US borders). As time goes on, they say they want 25% ethanol in gasoline as the old cars that won't "take" ethanol are phased out, and more land is converted to growing corn.

That will only make it imperative that we drain our small engines and consume every drop of fuel in the lines and carb.

Bob

Edited by Bobinyelm, 26 February 2010 - 06:11 PM.

[Joe Z]

Good article Bob... I read all five pages ..... I usually run mine once a month for thirty minutes (eco mode off) under a load but got lazy once and let it go three months and sure enough half choke was needed to keep it running.... I was lucky i took it off eco mode and ran it about an hour under a load and it cleared up ......I usually use sta-bil but someone somewhere suggested using strictly high test but i am uncertain if the constant higher octane will do any damage?______
Also in your supplied article they mentioned SeaFoam?  Is that like the fogging spray they use in boat motors cylinders to winter over so the cylinder doesn't rust inside?______

Joe

[Fireballsocal]

Higher octane will not damage the engine but it will make it run slightly richer and les efficiently. Higher octane will not "keep" longer than regular so continue with your stabil or sea foam. Sea Foam is also a fuel stabilizer.

[Bobinyelm]

Sea Foam is not just a stabilizer:

http://www.articlesbase.com/environment-ar...ife-774754.html

Here are user-ratings from Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/MOTOR-TREATMENT-MULT...iews/B0002JN2EU

If you can get Aviation Gasoline 100LL (100 octane, "Low Lead"), it will not deteriorate in the fuel tank for at least a year, BTW.
Expect to pay about $4.25/gal, but it beats having to add stabilizer, or disassembling your carb.
You can get it at any general aviation airport. It's unlawful to use in a motor vehicle used on the street (it still has a very very small
amount of lead in it, so it's a non-no in catalytic converter equipped engines), but is legal off-road, or in stationary equipment (like generators).

I've found it runs better in small engines (generators, chain saws, mowers) than car gas. It's not the octane; possibility the lower vapor pressure.

Bob

Edited by Bobinyelm, 26 February 2010 - 09:41 PM.

[Joe Z]

Hey Bob
I must be living in a shell that i never heard of SeaFoam....completely read the first link and it sounds good and i always go to Amazon to get an un-biased opinion (which was very good on this product).... something interesting i read in one of the reviews was putting it into the power brake vacuum hose. Back in the early 70's when i worked for a buick dealership as a mechanic they used to have me pour a can of automatic transmission fluid slowly into a high idling older car carburator..... while it smoked to holy heck for about five minutes it cleaned out the whole top end...valves, carburator etc and the car ran alot better..... this must be the same principle with slightly different chemicals.
thanks,
Joe

[Fireballsocal]

Bob, why would you run 100 octane aviation gasoline at $4.25 a gallon that you have to go to a specialized shop for when the engine was designed for 87 octane that you can find at any gas station for $2.87 a gallon (Current Ca. price)? You only need to use a stabilizer if the generator will sit for months at a time and the little honda needs very little stabilizer.

[Bobinyelm]

Bob, why would you run 100 octane aviation gasoline at $4.25 a gallon that you have to go to a specialized shop for when the engine was designed for 87 octane that you can find at any gas station for $2.87 a gallon (Current Ca. price)? You only need to use a stabilizer if the generator will sit for months at a time and the little honda needs very little stabilizer.

I am not saying I presently do (though given how little the Honda drinks, it would not be that extravagant), but I used to use avgas because I had an ample supply of it when I had fleet of floatplanes in Alaska, and a 500gal tank of 100LL at my disposal.

After using it a few times, it struck me how well it burned in everything, and how stable (by design) the fuel is. I would have gladly paid $4.25 a gallon to have avoided the hassles of removing, disassembling and cleaning the Honda carb, as well as having replaced hoses and diaphragms in other small equipment destroyed by ethanol in gasoline used in the equipment. It's NOT the octane that to my knowledge makes the equipment run smoother, BTW.

In the Lower 48 (when I moved to WA), I had several classic cars in which I burned the stuff (the lead was good for the valves) and year after year, I would just park them in early October after the driving season, and in Spring just turn the key and they would roar to life. Never a BIT of varnish or fuel deterioration. There, I had friends with warbirds from WWII who would give me the gas they drained each Spring from their expensive airplanes before the flying season that had sat in their tanks all winter. Some of the stuff was probably 2 years old before I used it-again NOT decomposition of the fuel, with no stabilizer needed to be added. I understood why they got rid of the old fuel. At $5000+ for a carburetor, they felt it was worth the expense of using fresh fuel.

In speaking w/ the folks at the small engine shop I buy my parts here in TX, they told me business for fuel-system replacements has improved considerably since ethanol has become nearly universal here in TX. I wish they would state on the pumps whether what we are buying has ethanol-instead ALL pumps post the warning, even if a certain station sells ethanol-free gasoline.

I'd pay the extra $1.50 a gallon without hesitation, to answer your question, especially when I consider that I've probably burned less than 20 gallons gasoline in my Honda and my small equipment in the last couple of years. That would mean I spent $30 extra to save myself at least that much in repair parts, not to mention down-time on equipment that I have $2000+ tied up in.

Bob

Edited by Bobinyelm, 27 February 2010 - 12:13 PM.

[Bobinyelm]

Hey Bob
I must be living in a shell that i never heard of SeaFoam....completely read the first link and it sounds good and i always go to Amazon to get an un-biased opinion (which was very good on this product).... something interesting i read in one of the reviews was putting it into the power brake vacuum hose. Back in the early 70's when i worked for a buick dealership as a mechanic they used to have me pour a can of automatic transmission fluid slowly into a high idling older car carburator..... while it smoked to holy heck for about five minutes it cleaned out the whole top end...valves, carburator etc and the car ran alot better..... this must be the same principle with slightly different chemicals.
thanks,
Joe

I didn't read the reviews, but the way we used to use that (and other similar products-Marvel Mystery Oil, and even kerosene) was to ingest the stuff until the engine finally stalled in a cloud of smoke, then let the engine sit overnight. That dissolved and loosened valve deposits, which were fully dislodged when the engine was started and run fairly hard the next day. It was referred to as "an Italian tune-up," and worked wonders on high performance classic cars that were being used in especially short-trip driving.

If this is done today, it's important to find a product that says it's safe for catalytic converters.

Bob

[Fireballsocal]

I would imagine the lead in avgas, which is a lubricant among other benefits, caused the engines to run slightly smoother and quieter which gave you the idea that the engines ran smoother. If these engines were designed for 87 octane, they were running rich though and actually not as efficient as running on 87 octane. I hear you about the stabile nature of avgas. With all of the other aditives they put in pump gas these days, they could atleast put in some kind of stabilizer so it doesn't turn to varnish in 6 months (Depending on the application).

[Pickle-ette]

I would imagine the lead in avgas, which is a lubricant among other benefits, caused the engines to run slightly smoother and quieter which gave you the idea that the engines ran smoother. If these engines were designed for 87 octane, they were running rich though and actually not as efficient as running on 87 octane. I hear you about the stabile nature of avgas. With all of the other aditives they put in pump gas these days, they could atleast put in some kind of stabilizer so it doesn't turn to varnish in 6 months (Depending on the application).

So far, we can still get regular gas without ethanol.  Pumps have to state if gas has alcohol, but stations who sell without the alcohol have large lettered signs advertising the fact.  Cost is usually the same.

With one tankfull, heading south to Texas, I got about 10 percent better mileage in our 03 Caravan than I did later with the ethanol polluted fuel.

D

[Bobinyelm]

So far, we can still get regular gas without ethanol.  Pumps have to state if gas has alcohol, but stations who sell without the alcohol have large lettered signs advertising the fact.  Cost is usually the same.

With one tankfull, heading south to Texas, I got about 10 percent better mileage in our 03 Caravan than I did later with the ethanol polluted fuel.

D

That's a GREAT idea!
Here, all pumps have the "May have up to 10% ethanol" sign.

For those who are interested, you CAN get a kit to test for ethanol; here's a video how to test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsSQSuCiUjE

Bob

Edited by Bobinyelm, 27 February 2010 - 02:05 PM.

[micasita_17]

So far, we can still get regular gas without ethanol.  Pumps have to state if gas has alcohol, but stations who sell without the alcohol have large lettered signs advertising the fact.  Cost is usually the same.

With one tankfull, heading south to Texas, I got about 10 percent better mileage in our 03 Caravan than I did later with the ethanol polluted fuel.

D

That's a GREAT idea!
Here, all pumps have the "May have up to 10% ethanol" sign.

For those who are interested, you CAN get a kit to test for ethanol; here's a video how to test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsSQSuCiUjE

Bob

I watched the video, and at the end, it says "Ethanol Sucks"

That is prejudiced.
Ethanol makes our air much cleaner, helps free us from buying oil from Arabs who hate us, and helps local farmers sell corn for FAR HIGHER
prices than they could otherwise sell their crops for.

It's a win-win for everyone.

I don't know how it could possibly hurt anything in a car or a generator. Gasoline is gasoline as far as I am concerned, and the Government
wouldn't let us use it if it didn't work just fine.

Personally, I would NEVER use something rated at 100, if the manufacturer says to use 87. Sounds to me like you could overload the poor little
Honda or make it overheat if the gas has too much energy inside it.

We just make sure to drain the fuel every time we use our Honda, then run it until it stops. That way there is no fire hazard, either.

Paula

Edited by micasita_17, 27 February 2010 - 05:47 PM.

[notlawd]

So far, we can still get regular gas without ethanol.  Pumps have to state if gas has alcohol, but stations who sell without the alcohol have large lettered signs advertising the fact.  Cost is usually the same.

With one tankfull, heading south to Texas, I got about 10 percent better mileage in our 03 Caravan than I did later with the ethanol polluted fuel.

D

That's a GREAT idea!
Here, all pumps have the "May have up to 10% ethanol" sign.

For those who are interested, you CAN get a kit to test for ethanol; here's a video how to test:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsSQSuCiUjE

Bob

I watched the video, and at the end, it says "Ethanol Sucks"

That is prejudiced.
Ethanol makes our air much cleaner, helps free us from buying oil from Arabs who hate us, and helps local farmers sell corn for FAR HIGHER
prices than they could otherwise sell their crops for.

It's a win-win for everyone.

I don't know how it could possibly hurt anything in a car or a generator. Gasoline is gasoline as far as I am concerned, and the Government
wouldn't let us use it if it didn't work just fine.

Personally, I would NEVER use something rated at 100, if the manufacturer says to use 87. Sounds to me like you could overload the poor little
Honda or make it overheat if the gas has too much energy inside it.

We just make sure to drain the fuel every time we use our Honda, then run it until it stops. That way there is no fire hazard, either.

Paula

Most vehicle manuals state 87 octane or HIGHER.

The rest of your post about Arabs, etc. is clearly just trolling in order to antagonize others so it is not worth commenting on.